Speed versus time question

EricV

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#21
@Shawn K - In Sweden 14 year olds can drive "tractors" limited to 2 persons and a max speed of 20 mph. LINK Common in other EU countries at different ages too.

BBGs are all about managing the stopped time. If you're just getting fuel, no bio break or food off the bike, examine everything you do and ask yourself if it's really necessary. I see a lot of people taking off helmets and gloves at gas only stops. Simply asking yourself why you do something, then figuring out if there is a way to avoid that will shave time off your stops.

Example - The need to remove a glove to get a credit card out of a wallet. Solution - Keep a couple of credit cards and/or some cash in a jacket pocket that you can access w/o removing a glove at gas stops. I use the sleeve pocket on my Klim and Aerostich for this, with a small credit card folder that holds only two cards. I have a single $20 bill tucked behind one of the card, just in case.

I don't take off gloves, helmet or even get off the bike on a BBG unless I need to go inside. Some US gas stations still have bathrooms outside, meaning I only need to remove one glove unless I'm sitting down. Inside gas stations sometimes require helmet removal due to posted rules or security issues.

My normal habit is to fuel up while on the bike.

What else slows you down at fuel stops? Many riders need a key to open the fuel door on the bike. Removing the key from the ignition takes time. I remove the little flap on my gas caps and cut down a key so it just sticks out of the gas cap, then attach a small knob to the key stub so it sits flush while in the cap. I leave it there all the time. It's too short to use to start the bike. In some cases, that short key could be used to open luggage, if anyone noticed it and thought to do so while you were off the bike.

Examine every step on your fuel stop and consider things that might eliminate that step. A pen velcro'd to the outside of tank bag or where it's instantly accessible w/o unzipping anything. (tethered might be best for some conditions).

A small clipboard in the right place for odo/receipt pictures that just stays there, mounted in place.

Asking your credit card source for a tap to pay card is another idea. More and more pumps in the US have tap to pay readers now. No sliding the card in the slot that you can't always get it out of with gloves on.

Being able to comfortably and safely eat and drink water while riding is fairly common, but worth mentioning too. This is partly why I moved to a modular helmet when I started doing LD riding. I used to hit a drive thru Arbys or McD's just prior to starting a BBG or rally and pick up 5 small sandwiches like the plain roast beef or cheeseburgers. They don't make a mess when eating them and taste the same fresh and 20 hours later. Those got stuffed in the tank bag and eaten as desired while riding.
 

Dogpoope

Premier Member
#22
What is an "EPA kid"? Here in the States, the EPA is a governmental agency.
EPA-kids are 15-17 year olds, driving regular cars with special modifications made so they won't be able to drive faster than 22mph (35km/h). Nothing compares to slow traffic down over here.
 

Shawn K

Professional Cat Confuser
Premier Member
#23
@EricV - Thanks for the clarification. I learned something new today.

My last two marathon rides have taught me a lot about the art of the quick fuel stop. It doesn't seem like that big a deal in the moment, but those little things that Eric described are the difference between a 3-minute fuel stop and a 15-20 minute fuel stop. And over the course of a marathon ride, these things add up. On my last ride, I calculated that I could have gone Jax>SD>Jax in almost 5 hours less time if I had exercised better time management at my fuel stops. That alone would've put me at 102 hours total - almost a 100CCC
 
#24
Yep, if anything taught me more about stopped time discipline, it was the BBG. The hydration and eating while riding is huge. Of course, the eating is nothing fancy - like Eric said, some compact sandwiches, etc. I opted for some grapes, cheese sticks, and granola bars. I also positioned the cooler behind me so I could reach in there and pull another water/Gatorade bottle and put the empty one in there and shut the lid. Also, have a mindset of hitting your stops hard and efficiency right away while you are relatively fresh in the first part of the ride. That way you can build a cushion of time for those wee hours where you could give your brain and body a few precious extra minutes.

Another aspect that I found was extremely helpful was planning the stops. I always picked gas stations that were as close to the on/off ramp as possible, and if available, without having to cross any turn Lanes or wait for any traffic lights to cut across. A lot of these lights as slow and often they don't pick up a motorcycle sitting there waiting. I also avoided stops directly in the middle of an urban center; it was either right before or right after.

Toll passes are a great time saver too, and I use a half-face helmet which never came off and never drew any suspicious attention while on the few times I did a march to the restroom inside.

Had I not followed most of the advice listed here I am convinced my BBG would ended up being a failure. It's not how far you can ride, it's how little you can stay stopped!
 
#26
If a rider was traveling east at 57 mph and another rider was traveling west on the same road at 65 mph, and they are 923 miles apart at the start, at point would they meet?
 

EricV

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#28
My point of this thread was to ask everyone - where they're comfortable speed-wise. I know for example Oregon is slow @ 65 mph. Ontario is also quite slow, and the slowest leg of my C2C. 10% seems to be a consensus. Which is pretty much what I do - I know the IBA verification team can do some math and figure out the truth pretty easily anyhow...

--and so winter begins...
H
For those that speed consistently, that's a conversation best left off the internet. Ask some riders at an RTE next year if you want some more candid responses.

I lived in Oregon for ~45 years. It was 55 for a looong time. What you can get away with, in terms of law enforcement is variable, based on location and individual LEOs. You just stick with what's comfortable to you. As far as the IBA is concerned, the main thing that gets them looking at your speed is if your route covers and area known to be at a lower speed limit and you have submitted a ride that could simply not be done at that limit. Like a repetitive route SS1K over a stretch of road with a 45 mph speed limit. That would get denied. Aside from that, loosely speaking, you're an adult and it's expected that you are responsible for your own actions. Bragging on the internet about doing an IBA ride that you got a cert for at a stupid high speed limit will get noticed, likely reviewed, and possibly pulled from the IBA certified ride list or even get you booted from the IBA all together if the math shows you had to have consistently and blatantly ignored speed limits to excess. There is an element of 'don't ask, don't tell' going on here too.

The RCMP love to respond to motorist complaints and lie in wait for you with the Laser. BTDT got the ticket. (one of the riders in my group was behaving poorly.) If you're passing multiple cars at once or riding like a jerk or erratically, someone is going to call it in.
 

Dogpoope

Premier Member
#29
Good point as always @EricV.

BBG1500SE is one of those rides that has been questioned over here. A few years back no problem at all with most of the way at 75limit. Now you have everything between 40 to 70 with a few parts of 75. Extremly careful planning is needed to complete it without riding like a maniac. Some bits exceeds limit maybe but within flow of traffic.

A sidenote: you can do this ride after your first one is approved and I personally think that's way to soon for such demanding route. So easy to loose a few min at a stop and then you chase your plan instead of follow. Adding that they keep lower the limit to that and it will be impossible in a few years.
 

EricV

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#30
So easy to loose a few min at a stop and then you chase your plan instead of follow.
@Dogpoope - Very well stated Sir. Quote of the Day!

With regards to BBG pace rides, this is where a fuel cell and a greatly increased range helps a LOT. I used to have a ~500 mile/(800 km) range on my FJR at BBG pace. Being able to do a BBG ride in a more controlled speed area with only 2 stops* is a lot easier if you can comfortably stay on the bike between fuel stops. This is where the value of ergonomic adjustments to your bike really comes into play. I never "needed to get off the bike" as it was the most comfortable spot to be. Every rider and bike is different, but identifying things that make you want to get off the bike and finding ways to eliminate those issues goes a long way towards riding a long way. :D

*Edit added - I should have said 2 required fuel stops, but on IBA rides, there is that 350 mile max between documented receipts, so additional receipt stops would still be needed.
 
Last edited:

EricV

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#32
The LePera seats are not junk, and I see what you say about the Maverick and the way you fit your bike. That said, have you considered a full on custom seat or talked to your local upholstery shops? Showing them a picture of the LePera Maverick and talking about what bothers you on your current seat may get you a more comfortable seat in the end at less or equal cost. Bonus, the local shop can re-tweak it after you've ridden it enough miles to find out if it works or not and exactly what bothers you. With the LePera, you're in the position of selling another, albeit nice, seat to try something else, or trying to have someone re-work that. I don't know what resources are available to you in your area, but it might be worth asking around. I've seen some great seats built by local shops. I loved my RDLs, and did mail in on both of mine w/o re-works.

Aux tanks and ergonomic changes don't have to be $$$$. You can buy a 5 gal fuel cell for less than $100 usd and just make a frame locally to mount it to the bike.

I look forward to reading your thoughts.
 
#35
...
Anyone in mainland Europe want to comment on the conditions in Holland, Germany, Belgium, France, Spain, Portugal, Italy, Denmark, Sweden, Norway, Finland?
Norway/Sweden being particularly of interest for rides such as the European End to End?
Finland would be expensive if caught speeding as I believe fines are based on income!
I am from The Netherlands (Holland) in Europe and I can assure that a BBG is quite impossible in The Netherlands. Just too crowded on the roads.

I did my BBG last year in Germany/Poland; quite easy for me since I live near the German border. As you probably know many of the German Autobahns have no speed limit, but you have to choose them carefully. They can also be very crowded (especially during holiday season in summer) and there are lots of construction works... If you end up in traffic jam... well.
I did my BBG from the East of Holland straight towards the east through Germany into Poland/Warschau and back.

Poland has some very nice highways that were funded by the European Community, and you are legally allowed to drive up to 140 kph (87 mph). This is one of the highest max speed limits in the world. They have toll gates though, but if you stay on the right hand side and take the truck lane, you will save some time because the cars for some reason keep choosing the lanes where other cars are also waiting...
 

Shawn K

Professional Cat Confuser
Premier Member
#39
...but need to find some more intel on satellite based trackers - not iPhone based... :( as Mt Evans and Badwater are free of the constraints of cel phone service...
The Garmin InReach and SPOT lines of satellite trackers are the two 800-pound gorillas, and will likely end up being the direction you go. (Yes, there are other offerings, but Garmin and SPOT have the widest market adoption and largest knowledge base.)

Personally, I use the SPOT X, but that was my choice for battery longevity, stand-alone messaging performance (i.e., no need to pair with another device) and rechargeability. Your needs may differ. There's lots of info out there for those who will search.
 

EricV

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#40
-Sorry for the delays -

@EricV Custom upholstery is unfortunately a crapshoot at best. I had my 09 FLHX seat "reworked" by a hacker. It sucked, was ugly, and not even what I requested. The LePera, albeit pricy, is a "turn key" out of box solution. The crap thing is the stock seat on this baby has a heating element, and should be all you'd ever need. It is the Harley-Davidson Hammock with heating element. Supposedly leather seating surface, but as most companies do - it feels like it came from plastic cows. I can look locally, but here in eastern BC, I'd need to see what Calgary has. I haven't squeezed the trigger on the LePera just yet, but if I reworked what I have - I'd want to keep the heat...

Another option is: Ultimate Seats and maybe a luggage rack: Motherwell Rack which might get me looking into an: Aux Fuel Tank. From my reading, tying in a bulkhead fitting into the fuel tank is my best option, however, IDK the flowrate you might get. I'd wanna keep it under the 11.5 gal [?] IBR

My next consideration is a IBA series including a H2H Gold ride, but need to find some more intel on satellite based trackers - not iPhone based... :( as Mt Evans and Badwater are free of the constraints of cel phone service...

--wow-- off topic much...
For the same price as the Ultimate Seats product you can have a full custom Russell Day Long seat made for YOU, not the generic market. Seat Code S3 for a solo seat. LINK I've had two mail in RDLs and didn't need a re-work on either. Maybe a bit more if you're over 230 lb/104 kg or want leather, etc.

Some of the FLHs with a cross over line between tanks can be tapped into there. You only need to concern yourself with the 11.5 Gal limit if you're going to do the IBR or other endurance rallies that use that standard. There is no limit for cert rides.

As for Sat trackers, it depends on how much you want to spend and what you feel you need. A used Gen 1-3 Spot unit can be had cheap, then the flex rate tracking if you just want it for a particular ride.