Maximize Turn Around Time on a 100CCC

lnelson

Premier Member
#1
I have seen some talk about managing your time between the two 50 CC. I assume that means limiting sleep time during each 50 CC. What plans do use to make the best use of your long time stops - rest periods?
 

JAORE

Premier Member
#2
I assumed it meant that, if you are going for a 100CC take count of the time from the completion of the first 50 CC and the beginning of the second.

For example, you finish the first ride in 44 hours. Congratulations, you have a 50 CC.

You sleep for 10 hours and ride 48 hours for 50 CC number 2. Congratulations, you have a second 50 CC. But you don't have a 100 CC since you took 102 hours since you started the first 50 CC.

I could be wrong, my 50 CC experience is limited to a single DNF.
 

MTStarrett

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#3
From the ride rules:
"Some rides require back-to-back challenges. Here is how the rules are applied:

1. Each leg of a back-to-back series must be completed start to finish in the time allowed for a single leg, AND all legs of a back-to-back series must be completed start to finish in less than the total time calculated by adding the time allowed for each independent leg in the series. The term "leg" refers to the individual rides of a back-to-back series."

so a 100CCC consists of two 50CCs. Each has to be completed within 50 hours, and both need to be completed within 100 hours. Detailed rules and examples here http://www.ironbutt.com/themerides/50cc3/
 

lnelson

Premier Member
#4
Is it correct once you get the final receipt on the first 50 CC the time begins for the second 50 CC, so you could lose some overall time? For example, if you get the first leg in 44 hrs with your final receipt do you have have 50 hours left to finish the 100 cc in or can you sleep for 8 hrs, get a starting receipt and finish in 48 hrs? Is that what Jaore is saying?
 

JAORE

Premier Member
#5
Lnelson, I must not have been clear. Your first sentence is correct.

If you are trying for a 100 CC you have up to 50 hours for leg one. However long that leg takes, the clock for leg two starts right then. So you only have 50 hours for leg 2. In the case where you finish leg one in 44 hours, you have 50 hours from that point to complete the second 50cc leg. That is 94 hours total to finish both legs for the 100CC.

Of course this leads to an interesting possibility. Say you approach San Diego (coming from JAX) with 40 hours on the clock and 30 minutes riding to go. You could, I suppose, find a hotel, sleep for 7 hours and ride in for your final receipt on 50 CC #1. You still have 50 hours to return to JAX, but got a pretty good nap in there.
 
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Wombattle

Well-Known Member
#6
Is it correct once you get the final receipt on the first 50 CC the time begins for the second 50 CC, so you could lose some overall time? For example, if you get the first leg in 44 hrs with your final receipt do you have have 50 hours left to finish the 100 cc in or can you sleep for 8 hrs, get a starting receipt and finish in 48 hrs? Is that what Jaore is saying?
That's not correct unless you turn at hour 44 and start riding back on the second leg. Instead you can rest for as long as you like and get a start receipt for the second leg when you actually start riding back. That could be 8 hours rest and you start your second leg at hour 52 of the 100CCC clock. That'll give you 48 hours to ride the second leg to complete the 100CCC.

Or it could be 10 hours rest and you'll have 46 hours to ride back to do it in 100 hours. Or it could be 6 hours rest and you start it at hour 50. Up to you. My advice would be to get the start receipt for the second leg at the same place you got the end one for the first leg so you can prove you didn't start the second leg early. But that's just me.
 

cacomly

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#7
There are two aspects of managing your time between the two 50CCs. One is don't waste sleep by turning around as soon as you complete the first 50CC if you completed it under 50 hours. If you completed it in 44 hours as Wombattle said then you should get some sleep and not start the 2nd 50 clock until the first has expired.

The second is not to sleep too long "wasting" time so you are short for the 2nd 50CC. When I did mine I dipped into the 2nd 50CCs time by 2 hours because I needed that time and it worked for me.
 

Ira

Staff member
Premier Member
IBR Finisher
IBR Staff
#8
Is it correct once you get the final receipt on the first 50 CC the time begins for the second 50 CC, so you could lose some overall time? For example, if you get the first leg in 44 hrs with your final receipt do you have have 50 hours left to finish the 100 cc in or can you sleep for 8 hrs, get a starting receipt and finish in 48 hrs? Is that what Jaore is saying?
If you read the complete rules for back-to-back rides, you will see there are two ways to handle any extra time between the first leg and the second leg.

One way to do it is to start the second leg immediately after completing the first leg. So if you complete the first leg in, say, 44 hours, you turn around and head back the other way immediately. The receipt you obtain at the end of the first leg also acts as you start receipt for the second leg. The down side of doing this, of course, is that you could have used that extra six hours for rest with no penalty.

The other way to handle it (and the one most prefer) is to do what I just suggested - take the extra time for rest before starting the second leg. You should pick up a receipt at the end of the first leg to show you did it within the time limit, but doing so does not start the clock for the second leg. That happens when you pick up the start receipt for the second leg (which needs to be no later than the 50-hour mark). You could continue your rest at that point, however any additional time you take after the 50-hour mark is on the clock for the second leg. But if you need the rest, you need the rest.

The complete back-to-back ride rules are at

http://www.ironbutt.com/themerides/bbseries/

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association
 

BigLew55

Premier Member
#9
If you read the complete rules for back-to-back rides, you will see there are two ways to handle any extra time between the first leg and the second leg.

One way to do it is to start the second leg immediately after completing the first leg. So if you complete the first leg in, say, 44 hours, you turn around and head back the other way immediately. The receipt you obtain at the end of the first leg also acts as you start receipt for the second leg. The down side of doing this, of course, is that you could have used that extra six hours for rest with no penalty.

The other way to handle it (and the one most prefer) is to do what I just suggested - take the extra time for rest before starting the second leg. You should pick up a receipt at the end of the first leg to show you did it within the time limit, but doing so does not start the clock for the second leg. That happens when you pick up the start receipt for the second leg (which needs to be no later than the 50-hour mark). You could continue your rest at that point, however any additional time you take after the 50-hour mark is on the clock for the second leg. But if you need the rest, you need the rest.

The complete back-to-back ride rules are at

http://www.ironbutt.com/themerides/bbseries/

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association
(which needs to be no later than the 50-hour mark).
Ira, can you clarify this? I thought, probably based on older rules posted, that the clock would automatically start at 50 hours in this case, and that I would not have to wake just to get a receipt.

For instance, I finish leg 1 in 44 hours, but I want 8 hours sleep before getting my starting DBR for Leg 2 (essentially starting 2 hours in the hole). Can't I just sleep the 8 hours and get my DBR before leaving the vicinity, or do I really have to wake to get a starting receipt before 50hrs, even though I have the ending receipt for Leg 1 at 44 hours?
 

Ira

Staff member
Premier Member
IBR Finisher
IBR Staff
#10
Ira, can you clarify this? I thought, probably based on older rules posted, that the clock would automatically start at 50 hours in this case, and that I would not have to wake just to get a receipt.

For instance, I finish leg 1 in 44 hours, but I want 8 hours sleep before getting my starting DBR for Leg 2 (essentially starting 2 hours in the hole). Can't I just sleep the 8 hours and get my DBR before leaving the vicinity, or do I really have to wake to get a starting receipt before 50hrs, even though I have the ending receipt for Leg 1 at 44 hours?
I think that would be acceptable if you obtained the starting receipt for the second leg at the same location as the ending receipt for the first leg, thus demonstrating that you didn't use any left over time for the first leg to ride on the second leg. If you spent the time in a hotel, you should also include the hotel receipt as well as making an entry in your ride log. Remember - it's up to you to demonstrate you followed the rules.

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association
 

lnelson

Premier Member
#11
I'm glade I asked this question. As you can see it can be a little confusing. Both 50 CC's need to be under 50 hours and the overall 100 CC needs to be under 100 hours. It becomes the management of receipt times to make all of this rest time (and ride) successful. Thanks everyone for their input. Can't wait.....
 

AndyBlila

Premier Member
#12
I’m looking to do this as well. I completed my CC50 in 41 hours. I plan to do that again and then sleep for 8 hours, get up and eat, and then start the second leg at the 50 hour mark. If I complete the second leg in another 41 hours....the total clock will be 91 hours. Easy day.
 

kwthom

Rider
Premier Member
IBA Member
#13
On another forum a year or so ago, there was a rider that was posting while he was on his 100ccc.

His second 50cc was not nearly as efficient as his first leg. I want to think his whole ride was completed in 98 hours.
 
#14
My 100ccc ride report from last year is posted - I completed the first leg i.e. SD-Jax in 38 hours. Got a receipt as soon as I reached Jax; slept - went back to the same gas station 8 hours later - pulled another receipt and departed for the second leg i.e. Jax-SD. As Ken pointed out from another rider - my return leg was not as efficient either - I think somewhere around 40 hours. My total trip time from first receipt to final was 88 hours. Good luck - it is a fun challenging ride.
 

lnelson

Premier Member
#15
Thanks Scott, I knew I had read that somewhere. Was the second 50 cc less efficient because you were more tired or what do you attribute it too.
I plan to ride SD to Jax to SD also.
 
#16
I think it is safe to say fatigue was a factor. With all rides - I generally keep the first few fuel stops short and add minutes to planned stops after the halfway point to accommodate for fatigue rather than trying to maintain the same stop time for the entire ride.
 

Stephen!

Premier Member
IBA Member
#17
I think it is safe to say fatigue was a factor. With all rides - I generally keep the first few fuel stops short and add minutes to planned stops after the halfway point to accommodate for fatigue rather than trying to maintain the same stop time for the entire ride.
Rather than trying to maintain the same stop time while on a long ride (be it a cert or a rally), I purposely plan a little bit more time at every stop than what it normally takes. Solo kine rally ride, I plan 5 minutes for every bonus stop and don't add time for fuel stops. Two-up rally kine ride has me planning 8 minutes per bonus stop and, again, no added time for fuel stops. Cert ride finds me with 5 minute fuel stops and nothing else. For the rally rides, I bank time to be used for fueling by making each bonus stop faster than planned. When arriving at the fuel stop, I know how much "extra" time I have in the bank and know if this can be a "leisurely" stop or not...

By the end of the ride I am usually arriving within 10-15 minutes of my original ETA. Except that one 1088 where we had less than 6 minutes to DNF when we rolled in... :)