Rider pics 2015 IBR

Discussion in '2017 Iron Butt Rally' started by tdragger, Mar 4, 2016.

  1. tdragger

    tdragger Premier Member

    From the 2015 IBR I have a couple of checkpoint pics that I wanted to get to the riders. Can anyone identify these two?

    Owsley likes this.
  2. Ira

    Ira Staff Member Premier Member IBR Staff IBR Finisher

    Rider 23 is Paul Slaton. Rider 88 is Barry Bertram.

    Ira Agins
    Iron Butt Association
  3. Paul Slaton

    Paul Slaton Premier Member IBR Finisher

    Hey tdragger. Is that you, James?
  4. RFlagg42

    RFlagg42 IBR Finisher

    The comparison between those two pictures brings up an issue that surprised me in the 2015 IBR. One of the two riders above did not try and match the picture provided in the rally book.

    I have ridden in quite a few rallies. If the rally book says to take a picture of the "Fredericksburg Battlefield Visitors Center", I would have taken a picture similar to Barry's picture. If there is a sign in the picture that clearly reads "Fredericksburg Battlefield Visitors Center", then I would suggest that there can be little doubt in the scorer's mind that I took a picture of the correct building. However, Paul's photo more closely resembles the picture in the rally book here.


    I do not remember any instructions from the 2015 IBR rider meeting where the rally books were handed out that we were to attempt to best match the picture provided in the rally book. So, I went through Leg 1 giving those pictures little thought. Many others apparently did the same as at the rider meeting before Leg 2, we were "reprimanded" as a group for NOT matching the photos and therefore making the scoring process more difficult. Other than the Big Money Rally, I had never ridden in a rally where matching the provided picture was the bonus requirement. I made a point of doing that on Legs 2 and 3, but had to change my normal bonus stop routine. Not a big deal, it probably added 30 seconds to a minute at each bonus stop. I tried to look at the picture for the next bonus as I was leaving every bonus, that way I would be more likely to ride up and park in a good spot to take the desired photo (I do the same thing for the Big Money Rally). Taking the time to match the photos definitely made scoring fly by much more quickly. I think my Leg 3 photos were scored about 20 minutes faster than my Leg 1 photos were scored.

    An example from Leg 1 which made scoring challenging. Take a photo of your motorcycle with the Alan Bible Visitor Center in the background. Photo from rally book:

    My photo (about four people took a photo from the same perspective while I was at this bonus). There were no identifying words or signs on the actual building:

    The scorer has the sample photo on his computer screen. It is not clear that my photo is taken at the correct location. Now, it is reasonable to make that assumption given the shape of the roof, the presence of the palm trees, etc... but it still involves a lengthy conversation.

    A second example regarding the sample photos provided in the IBR rally books. If I have time when planning my route (typical 24 to 36 hour rallies and Leg 1 on a multi-day rally), I typically put the info from the rally pack on a particular bonus into the Notes field of the wayoint. That way, I can pull up the bonus requirement on my GPS as I'm approaching the bonus and I do not have to open the rally pack at all. On the 2013 IBR, I made it to my second to last bonus on Leg 1 without every opening the rally pack. At that particular bonus, the requirement was to take a picture of a museum, and I had the name of it on my GPS screen. None of the buildings in the vicinity of the bonus lat/long had that name. I called Lisa Landry asking for clarification. She asked, "Is there a building that looks like the building in the picture we provided in the rally packet?". Ummm....I responded that I didn't realize there were pictures in the rally pack.....oops. After looking at the picture, I was in fact calling her from in front of the correct building.
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2016
  5. Paul Slaton

    Paul Slaton Premier Member IBR Finisher

    Those are very good points Eric. It seems that the practice one gets from doing the BMR carries over nicely to the other rallies. The picture I submitted at the scoring table was better than the one above. In the one above, I was posing by the bike for a personal picture for James Epley who had been hovering in the area hoping to catch some IBR action in the making. I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that Barry was doing much the same.
    I don't know if it is a good thing to encourage folks to hang out at the bonus locations, but I can say that it was a real treat for me. James was the epitome of consideration and was completely respectful of the fact that I was on a clock. One of the highlights of the rally for me; running into one of the only people in the country who I didn't have to unsuccessfully try to explain what I was up to.
    Owsley and tdragger like this.
  6. Ira

    Ira Staff Member Premier Member IBR Staff IBR Finisher

    We've had problems in the past with spectators at bonus locations - that's why we generally don't publish them until the leg is over. On the other hand, we encourage spectators at the checkpoints.

    Ira Agins
    Iron Butt Association
  7. tdragger

    tdragger Premier Member

    Yes, sir. The only and only. Congrats on your achievement. I can only dream of getting there one day. If you want the high rez pic, send your email via PM.
  8. tdragger

    tdragger Premier Member

    My apologies if I created a major faux pas in cheering on the riders. Yes, Paul had taken his pic in front of the building and rolled over to get a bit of shade as it was quite warm that day.

    Paul, Barry and this guy you might know. It was right before dark and Jack was worn out and enjoyed talking for a few minutes.

    [​IMG]Backups by James Epley, on Flickr
  9. TheRoss

    TheRoss Premier Member IBR Finisher

    I personally felt cheered on when I encountered spectators at checkpoints, which happened twice. In both cases they had done some homework to figure out where they could be in order to see rally riders, since the official bonus list had not been published. Therefore, they were "one of us" and in both of my experiences the spectators were friendly and encouraging and understood that I didn't have time to talk. One guy had a cooler with cold bottled water ready, and gave me a couple before I pulled away. It was awesome. (As was that guy on the I-40 overpass at the start of leg 2... loved the encouragement).

    I listed the waypoints I wanted to hit each day on a large index card for my tankbag map sleeve. Low tech I know, but it works for me, since one GPS is working point to point. By leg 2 I had started drawing a little picture on the card of what the picture in the rally book looked like. Just a crude little sketch so I could get positioned for the "correct" picture as I pulled in, without having to pull out the rally book at every stop.
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2016
  10. Ira

    Ira Staff Member Premier Member IBR Staff IBR Finisher

    I think you are confusing checkpoints and bonus locations. In the last IBR, for example, the first checkpoint was in Albuquerque and the second was in Kingsport, TN. On the other hand, there were dozens of bonus locations.

    As I previously mentioned, we encourage folks to come to the checkpoints, but not to the bonuses, no matter how well- intentioned. Some examples of problems include riders being chased away from the bonus by employees from the bonus because so many folks showed up to catch a peek - in one case, a private security guard grabbed the rider's flag and took off. The rider had to literally chase him down to get it back. So although we know that spectators m would love to show up at the bonuses, it can make it hard on the riders and give the Iron Butt Rally an unintentional bad name.

    Thanks for understanding.

  11. TheRoss

    TheRoss Premier Member IBR Finisher

    Yes, I was referring to bonus locations, just didn't type the correct thing (trying to multi-task again).

    Wow... I only had good experiences with the public last summer! I didn't realize that others have had such difficult experiences with people they have met along their routes. Now that I really think about it, I can see the potential for problems.
  12. EricV

    EricV Premier Member IBR Finisher

    Having been to the Alan Bible Visitor Center many times, it's obvious to me you were in the correct location, but local knowledge is always king. For someone scoring that hasn't been there, under prior rally format, it would be a little challenging for the scorer and they might have had to ask up a level to verify.

    However, it's a whole new world now. Photo recognition software is now being used by rally masters and scorers. Certainly not in all rallies, but it's gaining ground and BMR and the IBR are using it, thus the issues you noted.

    Never pulled the rally pack out in '13? LOL, you're a brave man E, and you spent a bunch of time when you got to the checkpoints and finish filling out the rally pack there, I would guess. When I walked into the checkpoint, I was ready to score. The minimal time it takes to fill out the rally pack at bonus locations, re-read the bonus and double check the photo is worth it, for me. I would suggest it's worth it for most riders too. That doesn't mean I planned or executed a better rally than anyone else! But the only points I lost at scoring were for a rain soaked thermal receipt from my first bonus.
  13. RFlagg42

    RFlagg42 IBR Finisher

    I kept the log up to date (Earned Bonus Location sheet ?) as I went in '13, so I was ready for scoring within minutes as well. On Leg 1, I put a quick description of the bonus requirement in the notes section of the waypoint so that I could pull it up on my Montana GPS as I approached the bonus. "Take a picture of XXXXX Museum" only became an issue when the name of the museum wasn't anywhere on the building and I wasn't sure I was in the right place.

    My method has always been to ensure text is in the bonus photo so that there was no question by the scorer that I was in the right place. I'm OK with picture match as well, as it simplifies the scoring process. However, if bonuses and the required photo are not chosen carefully, or not given appropriate hours of availability, then photo match can become a chore, if not downright frustrating, at night. I've ridden away from several BMR bonuses at night while muttering "It's not worth the point....".
  14. EricV

    EricV Premier Member IBR Finisher

    Don't get me wrong, I think you make far better than average, (certainly better than me), use of your GPS notes capability. No issues with night bonuses on the IBR... there aren't any! (well, very few now). Glad you had the bonus sheet filled out as you went.

    BMR still seems to have a few issues with riders doing night bonuses. Some better standardization for that process will probably happen down the road. I've seen some bitter frustration from riders that attempted BMR bonuses at night and were denied by the scoring team. That never makes anyone happy.
    Steve Bracken likes this.
  15. Steve Bracken

    Steve Bracken Premier Member

    The BMR App isn't helping because despite its obvious advantages, it takes away all the camera controls so you are stuck with whatever vanilla settings it chooses. I learned that on the BMRx. It also only stores tiny thumbnails which are very poor quality for later using in Ride Reports, etc.

    In future I will not use it, except for the very few pictures that require the time-stamp.

    What the BMR has been great for is producing better pictures. I always did okay before, but having to work with picture and word matches has helped me consider bike placement much more keenly on the approach to a bonus.[/QUOTE]
  16. Paul Tong

    Paul Tong Verified NIITWIt Premier Member IBR Finisher

    That guy was James Stovall. He was the rallymaster who put on the Heart of Texas Rally for the last several years. I was so excited when I saw him on that bridge and it made that first day of leg 2 so much better. Good times.
  17. Olaf Moon

    Olaf Moon Olly "Moonshine"- #517 Premier Member IBR Finisher

    I met three people (Who had come to the site specifically to meet riders, by following their SPOT tracks) at different bonuses on the 2015 IBR. Each gave me a drink and cheered me on or gave words of support. Personally I loved it. BTW there was no one else around in any of the cases. Separately, I have been "steered away" from bonus sites by locals, usually from the bonus building themselves. Makes the photo-taking a very hurried business.
  18. Steve Bracken

    Steve Bracken Premier Member

    The worst I have ever experienced was the occasional polite enquiry as to what I was doing. Our bikes, and the gear we wear are quite a sight for most people not used to seeing them. When you pitch up in their back yard, it sometimes prompts questions. Never had a problem though. When I wanted to get a picture of the Alamo, the cop let me park illegally and he watched my bike while I walked around the corner and got the pic.
    Robert Foster likes this.

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