The Audacity of Requesting TWO Certs for One Ride !!

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#1
Yep, that's me. Some perspective. The year was 1991 and I think IBA membership was less then 1000. No website and most folks I knew had not yet purchased their first PC. Memorial Day weekend, as far as I know and validated by IBA, I became the first rider to cross the continent on a motorcycle in under a day and a half (35:08) No tracking, GPS, 5 gal stock fuel capacity (Yamaha FJ1200). Even my radar detector failed early on. Diet of broken Granola bars and Gatorade sipped thru an aquarium hose. It took months to verify my claim but I can't say enough good about Mike Kneebone and his people. I only did 2 small rides after that. 1992 and 93 Cal 24 Hr Rally, organized by my long departed good friend, Peter Heesch. Met some great people, incl the infamous Ron Major (1992) Have great memories incl. chasing down Maynard Hershon when he left his route sheet at a checkpoint in 92 (my FJ came in handy for that little mission)and turning back at 3am south of Alturas due to heavy snow (mid June of 93. Horrible weather that year. ) I live in Ga. and gave up the long rides to start family. Recently, I stumble upon the verification letter from IBA and realized I never received the 50cc or the BBG 1500. My fault. Seems that my request ruffled some feathers. Keep in mind I have been out of the loop the entire time IBA has been on the web. NEVER heard the term "one ride-one cert". I realize some of you are fit to be tied with this Covid crap, but that doesn't necessitate trivial, petty, back biting . Reminds me of my daughters' stint in middle school. My "exploits" in the motorized saddle don't even rate compared to countless current and past IBA members. We all have some stories to tell. I assure you my innocent little retrospective request stole not a minutes glory from a single IBA member. Ride safe people !!
 

Ira

Staff member
Premier Member
IBR Finisher
IBR Staff
#3
You shouldn't take it personally in any way. In your absence, this issue has become more of a quasi-religous question. Some think "one ride, one cert". Other believe it is legitimate to request more than one on the same ride under the guidelines.

But it isn't anything bitter - I just see it as two groups having a friendly difference of opinion. And that is perfectly fine. The IBA accommodates both points of view. :)

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association
 

CB650F

Premier Member
#4
Don't worry. Some people have easily ruffled feathers. They don't represent the IBA though, so they don't really matter. The people that actually make the IBA work don't have a problem with nesting rides. As far as I'm concerned, that settles any debate. If you are a "one ride one cert" kind of guy, only get one cert for your one ride and everyone will be happy. It's really a non-issue in my oh so humble opinion. Both groups can get exactly what they want.

Stick around and share some old war stories with us. Or, now that the kids have moved out (which I assume), get a few more rides under your belt. This year has been, well, it's been 2020, but next year should have plenty of riding opportunities.
 
#5
A humorous event on my above ride. I-10, west Texas, almost midnight. Cruising along about 10 over the limit (75 in a 65, I think) Grass, tumbleweed median, cop going east turns around to come after me. I'm thinking "are you serious"? Pulls me over. Talk about bored. Gives me a warning for 10 over the limit. I'm like "gee officer. thanks!" My best Leave It To Beaver impersonation. Hey, helped document the ride, I guess!!
 

JAORE

Premier Member
#6
I don't REALY know if I'm a one ride - one cert guy, but I think I am. I base that on the fact I try to have my few (7) certs all be a bit different. Like the (so far 3 of) 4 season rides.

Now when, if, I do something like a 50CC with multiple nesting potential I'll find out if I'll break that habit. It's easy to not give in to temptation when temptation never crosses your path.

One factor in my decision is I could nest every ride I even dream of and my bragging rights total would STILL pale around the real inmate totals. This path leads to madness.

But ride your own bike, submit your own documents, hang your own certificates.
 
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#9
I humbly admit I have nested rides a few times because I like the display of certificates. But I am also up front and honest that they don't represent the number of rides I have accomplished...
 
#11
I'm the primary care taker of my 89 year old mother, new job, the pandemic and life in general, I have not sent in my documentation yet. I wrote everything down and documented all stops with receipts. I need to trace out the trip on a map and get it sent in.
I will get two certificates. An in state Arkansas SS 1000 and The Leap Year 2020. I did it all on leap day, 2 certificates, 1 ride.
I was the 22nd person to earn the Four Seasons SS 1000 award.
Winter Solstice SS 1000, 1 certificate.
Fall Equinox SS 1000 all in Texas, SS 1000 in state Tx. 2 certificates.
Summer Solstice SS 1000, SS 1000 in state Ok. 2 certificates.
Spring Equinox SS1000, SS 1000 in-city insanity Okc. (SS 1000 Okc) 2 certificates.
4 Seasons SS 1000, 1 certificate.
4 rides, 8 certificates.
My first ride was an organized IBA ride. It started near Dallas. 4 of us went, 2 in a truck/trailer, myself and a friend on bikes.
We all did an SS1000 from the start point, The Colony, Tx . It was 200 miles from Okc to Dallas. I counted the 200 miles, then the SS1000, then did a round about 300+ miles back home. SS 1000, BB 1500, 2 certificates, 2 pins, one ride.
Total, I've done 13 rides for 18 certificates (2 certificates pending). One certificate is a Silver Mile Eater.
One of my BBG's was a spring equinox, one ride, 1 certificate.
Would I do a Border to Border or a Coast to Coast and try to count every 1000 miles as an SS1000? No.
I have no problem with the certificates I have for the amount of rides I have done. I earned every one of them. IBA pins resize.jpg
 

yakulis

Premier Member
#12
- I will get two certificates. An in state Arkansas SS 1000 and The Leap Year 2020. I did it all on leap day, 2 certificates, 1 ride.
- Fall Equinox SS 1000 all in Texas, SS 1000 in state Tx. 2 certificates.
- Summer Solstice SS 1000, SS 1000 in state Ok. 2 certificates.
- Spring Equinox SS1000, SS 1000 in-city insanity Okc. (SS 1000 Okc) 2 certificates.
Nice collection, and thank you for sharing!

I learned something, because I didn't know it was possible to get two certificates from one SS1000 ride as you did several times above.
 

Ira

Staff member
Premier Member
IBR Finisher
IBR Staff
#13
Nice collection, and thank you for sharing!

I learned something, because I didn't know it was possible to get two certificates from one SS1000 ride as you did several times above.
The basic rule is that if one ride is by definition completed within another, we only issue one certificate. In the cases above, there is a small loophole for those doing a geographically-based SS1K (such as an in-state SS1K) at the same time they are doing a temporal-based SS1K (such as a Four Seasons SS1K). It technically meets the rule - one could do an in-state ride without necessarily doing a solstice ride, for example. And vice versa. I leave it to the religious warriors to decide if it meets the spirit of the rule. :)

In any case, I recommend doing what you think is right in such a circumstance.

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association
 
#14
Some incredible riders in IBA. Not sure I understand the draw in getting numerous Saddlesore 1000 patches or doing 65 BBG 1500 rides. I did the equivalent of a Saddlesore 1000 in 1983 just riding from FLL to PHL on my Yamaha 650 Maxim. Thought nothing of it. Had as yet not even heard of IBA, which had few if any members then. You can make a Saddlesore 1000 interesting and even scenic, but a BBG 1500......seems like purposeless locomotion, the majority of the time. Personally, a single 100 cc Insanity makes more sense then the monotonous drudgery of 65 BBG 1500 rides. To each his own, I guess.
 

Greg Rice

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#15
Some incredible riders in IBA. Not sure I understand the draw in getting numerous Saddlesore 1000 patches or doing 65 BBG 1500 rides. I did the equivalent of a Saddlesore 1000 in 1983 just riding from FLL to PHL on my Yamaha 650 Maxim. Thought nothing of it. Had as yet not even heard of IBA, which had few if any members then. You can make a Saddlesore 1000 interesting and even scenic, but a BBG 1500......seems like purposeless locomotion, the majority of the time. Personally, a single 100 cc Insanity makes more sense then the monotonous drudgery of 65 BBG 1500 rides. To each his own, I guess.
You are right, to each their own. It seems funny that someone comes on a long distance riding forum and bad mouths people who ride long distance.

You posted on this forum begging for two certificates for one ride and now you want to tell others that you don’t understand.

I am surprised someone living in the south like you is so disrespectful to others.
 

CB650F

Premier Member
#16
You are right, to each their own. It seems funny that someone comes on a long distance riding forum and bad mouths people who ride long distance.

You posted on this forum begging for two certificates for one ride and now you want to tell others that you don’t understand.

I am surprised someone living in the south like you is so disrespectful to others.
There is no disrespect or bad mouthing in his post at all. He pointed out his own lack of understanding of what makes other people tick, told us what he sees more value in (100CC Insanity rather than 65 BBGs), then gracefully acknowledged that people are different and to each his own.

Settle down and don't be so quick to ruffle your feathers. It's not befitting the IBA, and is an absolutely terrible way to treat a new member who admittedly doesn't understand what makes someone else tick. Instead of getting yourself flustered, be productive and tell him why you see value in doing 65 BBG rides and how they are more than purposeless locomotion.
 

OX-34

Premier Member
IBR Finisher
#17
CB650F,
I think when you have completed your 65th BBG you may be in a better position to understand how reading on the Iron Butt Forum that your efforts are "purposeless locomotion" and "monotonous drudgery" may ruffle your feathers.

All power to you Greg. You are an inspiration to those of us who do get it.


Tally-ho it has been great to read of your rides 40 years ago that have paved the way for many. Just remember that thousands of riders have come to Iron Butt riding since you started and some at the pointy end have raised the bar well beyond anything you contemplated while riding FLL to PHL (wherever that is).

Personally I have done almost 100 IBA rides: in 3 countries (plus partly in Canada), 100CCCs in 2, SSs on 20+ different bikes from 105cc to 1832cc, 1-2-3-4 and 6 cylinders, a couple of scooters, drawn pics of a shark, kangaroo, a side of beef and a great big chicken, BBGs on bikes and scooter down to 300cc, pillioned a couple and ridden the odd rally. Twisties, interstate, backroads, snow, desert and tropics.

I consider the rider's ride to be the rider's ride. The dismissive missive "to each his own, I guess" is disrespectful in the context you used it.
 

CB650F

Premier Member
#18
CB650F,
I think when you have completed your 65th BBG you may be in a better position to understand how reading on the Iron Butt Forum that your efforts are "purposeless locomotion" and "monotonous drudgery" may ruffle your feathers.

All power to you Greg. You are an inspiration to those of us who do get it.
Ah, the classic "he did something you didn't do" response. Just like Greg's response, yours is not befitting of the IBA, an organization that should pride itself on the helpfulness and kindness of its members. If you're going to take the time to write out a response, the least you could do it explain the planning and effort required to reach those goals. Spread around the knowledge and experience you've gained through your almost 100 IBA rides in 3 countries and many various bikes. That how you get people interested in such things. Just saying that you've done lots of rides is nothing more tooting your own horn.

Not only is "to each his own, I guess" not disrespectful, but you've certainly given him no reason to respect you. He's new here. Treating new people who don't understand something in such a manner is a great way to turn them away from the IBA. That's how such organizations die. Don't be a dickhead. Be nice to new people. Let your experience show itself through your kindness and willingness to help others. Or you could shake your fist at all those kids on your lawn and wonder why nobody comes to visit you. Your choice.
 

kwthom

Rider
Premier Member
IBA Member
#19
<...>If you're going to take the time to write out a response, the least you could do it explain the planning and effort required to reach those goals.
Yet, Tally-ho 'walks in here', explains his circumstance (not a unique request, but only due to time elapsed...) and the request is resolved to his satisfaction. Kudos to Mike K & team for having that data still available.

'New Member' here simply means new member on the forum. They could well be long-ago IBA members, like Tally-ho, and fully understand the planning and tools needed to do those rides.

Greg has mentored dozens of riders, and has actually done seminars long ago on various LD riding topics. His web pages have a wealth of information available. I'm fairly sure that Peter has some similar efforts in 'raising the bar' on LD riding down in Australia.
 

CB650F

Premier Member
#20
Greg has mentored dozens of riders, and has actually done seminars long ago on various LD riding topics. His web pages have a wealth of information available. I'm fairly sure that Peter has some similar efforts in 'raising the bar' on LD riding down in Australia.
That's not an excuse to be an asshole. Both of them should be extremely nice and polite rather than abrasive and condescending towards new members. Their behavior here is shameful and they should be called out for it.

Watch this: "A BBG requires an average speed of higher than 60 mph (100KMH) for 24 hours. That's no sleep, no rest stops, no nothing. That means, once you factor in rest stops, fuel stops, food stops, etc. you need to be riding 75 mph for the majority of the day. You need to have access to roads that can safely support those speeds. And that assumes your time management at fuel stops is good. The ride is just as much about the planning of the ride as it is about riding the plan. That's why a BBG is a significant accomplishment." That's a quick, easy, and helpful reply about what goes into a BBG and why someone might want to do it. It's also shorter than complaining about how you're offended by someone else's lack of knowledge.

I guess this thread demonstrates why the IBA has about 75,000 members, but this forum is all but dead. New member 'walks in here', explains his circumstance, and gets the situation resolved. In that process, the current members make him feel unwelcomed and as if his request was out of line despite it being a very common occurrence. Then in his thread that is essentially an apology for offending those who disagree with him getting two certs for one ride, and a compliment to those past and present in the IBA, he gets berated for not understanding that some rides are more about the logistics of figuring out how to do the ride, rather than the ride itself. Seriously, this forum should be full of people sharing experiences and exchanging ideas, but it's mostly requests for forum status changes, people asking what's taking so long with their certification package, and clarification on ride details. There's a whole section devoted to ride reports, but it's so rarely used.

Being an asshole because you have more experience than someone else is asinine. Be helpful to them and share what your experience has taught you. Nobody likes an asshole.
 
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