"Nesting" Rides - rides within rides

Ira

Staff member
Premier Member
IBR Finisher
IBR Staff
#21
To reiterate the basic rule, if one ride by definition is completed within another, we only issue one certificate. For example, everyone who completes a BBG has by definition also completed a Saddlesore 1000 and a Bun Burner 1500. So we would only issue the BBG cert.

On the other hand, one can complete a Bun Burner 1500 without necessarily completing a Saddlesore 1000 (e.g., one completes the first 1,000 miles in 25 hours but 1,500 miles in 36 hours). So we could issue both certs.

That is the kind of analysis you need to go through for the rides you have in mind.

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association
 

David Goebel

Premier Member
#22
On the other hand, one can complete a Bun Burner 1500 without necessarily completing a Saddlesore 1000 (e.g., one completes the first 1,000 miles in 25 hours but 1,500 miles in 36 hours). So we could issue both certs.
IRA, I get the first example, that makes sense completely. but if one didn't complete the first 1,000 miles in less than 24 hrs, why would both certs be issued, or rather which two certs could be issued?
So does that mean if I'm doing the Pines to Palms Gold (P2PG approx 2300 miles) in 48 hours (The Defined Ride), I can't earn a BBG 1500 in the first 24 hrs of the P2PG 48hrs, or a Saddlesore 2000 as I pass through the 2000 miles on my way to the finish of the P2PG?
 

Ira

Staff member
Premier Member
IBR Finisher
IBR Staff
#23
IRA, I get the first example, that makes sense completely. but if one didn't complete the first 1,000 miles in less than 24 hrs, why would both certs be issued, or rather which two certs could be issued?
So does that mean if I'm doing the Pines to Palms Gold (P2PG approx 2300 miles) in 48 hours (The Defined Ride), I can't earn a BBG 1500 in the first 24 hrs of the P2PG 48hrs, or a Saddlesore 2000 as I pass through the 2000 miles on my way to the finish of the P2PG?
I think you misunderstand.

I should have said "So we could issue both certificates assuming one successfully completes both rides." I mean, what's the point, for example, of awarding both a Saddlesore 1000 and a Bun Burner GOLD certificate on the same ride - if you completed 1,500 miles in 24 hours, it's obvious you also completed 1,000 miles in 24 hours.

I prefer to leave the analysis of specific cases as an exercise for the reader :), but I take a shot here.

In the first instance, the question is "can I get awards for completing both a 2,300-mile/48-hour ride and a 1,500-mile/24-hour ride at the same time?" In other words, if you if you finish the longer ride, have you by definition completed the shorter ride? The answer is no, you haven't. One can complete the longer ride without finishing the shorter ride (e.g., the first 1,500 miles in 25 hours but the 2,300 miles within 48 hours.) And because one is not by definition completed within another, we can issue both certificates (just be sure to document your location with a receipt at the 1,500-mile/48-hoour mark).

In the second instance, the question is "can I complete 2,300 miles in 48 hours without necessarily completing 2,000 miles in 48 hours?" The answer here is that you obviously cannot complete one without completing the other. So we would issue one or the other but not both.

Clear as mud? :)

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association
 

David Goebel

Premier Member
#24
o_O:eek: I'll keep really good records, submit what I think I can get certs for and let the verifiers tell me what qualified until I understand it better. My riding buddy wanted to do 9k in 10 days for our first big outing, we've dialed that back a bit....<G> Does the IBA mind if I send in too much money with my Certification applications???
I'll start this new year with upgrading to Premier in just a sec....
 

Ira

Staff member
Premier Member
IBR Finisher
IBR Staff
#25
o_O:eek: I'll keep really good records, submit what I think I can get certs for and let the verifiers tell me what qualified until I understand it better. My riding buddy wanted to do 9k in 10 days for our first big outing, we've dialed that back a bit....<G> Does the IBA mind if I send in too much money with my Certification applications???
I'll start this new year with upgrading to Premier in just a sec....
If you submit electronically, we will invoice you when the verification(s) is complete. Submit what you think will fly and we will let you know if it's doable.

Ira Agins
Iron Butt Association